Best place to start

[inkedmn]

Originally posted by Valmont
I second that!
But should someone who is exploring the world of programming really spend (quite a bit of) money in such an early stage?

on what?

If you're referring to C#, note that i was only recommending that if he *has* to learn a microsoft language (which i really don't think he should).

python's open source, and so are several good editors and OS's

[sde]

Originally posted by Valmont
Basically I am positve about almost every single language and environment but one has to place everything in it's context I feel.

how do you feel about RPG ? now that is one ugly language .. but i suppose it serves its purpose.

i agree with ink on the c# thing .. now a days if you are going to choose between vb and c#, do c# since its c style syntax will make you more comfortable with other languages, and also it is the language that was developed specifically for .net .. so there's no legacy code.

for web scripting, php is still by far my favorite hands down.

[Belisarius]

Python, C, C++, Java, all have one big advantage over VB and C#; coolness. All us Unix zealots look down on those two upstart languages. Sure, we might not have rational reasons for our dislike of them, but we wouldn't be zealots if we did.

[journeyman]

Oooh my head hurts so bad

See, this always happens, the more opinions you get - well the more opinions you get if you see what I mean. A couple of more postings and we should cover the rest of the alphabet and if we wait long enough a representative of the planet Ultron will post telling me that personally they prefer leaving this stuff to their fish

But I think between you're much appreciated postings we're getting there though, looks like at the moment I could do worse than begin by looking at c# and python.

Does this sound a reasonable/achievable start for the average joe who just wants at this stage to get a basic grounding/understanding of coding ?

[sde]

well .. if you just want to get a basic understanding of coding, .. maybe PHP would be good.

there is ALOT of support for it on the web, it is free, and an excellent place to get your feet wet. www.php.net

it would be web scripting though.. which is not a bad place to start for a n00b.

once you make a little web page or 2, .. you can download MySQL and start messing around with database interactions. very easy with php. www.mysql.com <-- also a free database

if you are running windows, just install IIS as your web server, and php will install automatically after that.

if you want to get into non web programming, then java or c# would be better. they are far more strict though.

sorry to throw another wrench in the gears, .. but that's my advice. php to start. it's great for a beginner, .. and can be very powerful for advanced users too.

[ender]

I agree with valmont here as well Each language does have its own special purpose. But that is not the reason why I posted, just a feature

I started with QBasic, but that was nothing more than extended if-else statements for questions, which worked, but wasn't really when I started learning to program. I started with C/C++, which I don't recommend, even though it worked for me.

I would recommend starting with a free language (Java, Python, Perl). Python would be my choice as I like its syntax better than C based languages (however you will have to learn it at some point) and move from there.

There is a chicken-and-the-egg problem with learning programming in that you have to juggle learning the syntax with learning 'how' to program, such as how loop structures are used, programming techniques and stuff. This can be a problem. That is why I recommend a syntax-englightening language with features that something like C doesn't have without a lot of syntax work.

Well, there it is, my input. Good luck, and if you have any questions, you know where to ask!

Ted Morse

[journeyman]

There you go, we've covered the alphabet and those Ultron fish can't be far away now

But thanks for those links though, I'll take a look. Really though I think I'm best off making a decision to follow up with c# and python otherwise I'm just gonna get more links and never make a decision. Which I suppose is probably a massive labour saving plan

So if anyone has any really useful links, pieces of advice about these - feel free.

Cheers to all who have been helping so far

The Journeyman

[journeyman]

In my previous posts I had typed in java when I meant to type in python, no harm done I think - did it twice but have now edited and corrected. So to clarify - am now focussed on c# and python.

Unless of course you know different....... ?

[Valmont]

Originally posted by inkedmn
on what?

If you're referring to C#, note that i was only recommending that if he *has* to learn a microsoft language (which i really don't think he should).

python's open source, and so are several good editors and OS's

Ahh, I see.

[journeyman]

IMHO everyone who has been so helpful on this thread has offered both genuine and helpful advice for which I am grateful. I do know enough to know this was not a thread that would yield a simple answer. However I do feel that between you all you have pointed me in a positive direction. I will probably start with Python simply because that seems to be a wide-ranging and immediately accessible route.

I gotta say you guys contribute in the best tradition and a lot of folks could benefit from your concise and informative style.

Brilliant

[Nanuu Nanuu]

F.15.12 - 6.9.13.8 - 15.13.15.1.C.C.19 - 4.5.3.9.4.5 - 6.F.12 - 15.13 !

[journeyman]

Hi Nanuu Nanuu,

Shazbut !!! - Just knew them Ultron fish were gonna show up

[Epsilon]

I guess it depends on what you want to do with your programming. If you want to develop desktop applications, C++ is one obvious choice.

When I started my journey into programming about 10 years ago (not counting BASIC, which I learned in high school in the late '80s) the first language I learned was Perl. Back then it was super-popular, since PHP hadn't been invented yet.

If you want to get into web programming you can hardly go wrong with PHP and MySQL. A solid understanding of both will enable you to program almost any imaginable web application. And a big bonus is they're both relatively easy to learn.

[journeyman]

Yes life was simpler with the old Sinclair zx81 (fond memories) a few line numbers, an IF, THEN or GOTO and you'd create a never ending, but oh so pleasing loop. Pointless, but somehow happy making .

Then I turned my back for twenty years and now look !

I've downloaded the Python compiler and tutes and so will begin looking at that, and whip round a few forums. I know I will have to look at c++ at some point if only to get an overview. But at this stage even the terminology of coding is foreign to me, let alone the syntax.

But cheers for the added input Epsilon and happy coding

[bdl]

Just to throw in my 2 cents worth; I should first say that I'm in no way a professional programmer, but have a good solid background in different aspects of coding as far back as working with BASIC in my teens (which would have been '84). I tend to agree with most of what's been said, especially with the aspect of learning PHP (big surprise, me being a PHP advocate). You will learn good C style procedure, not to mention the OOP aspect already inherent in the current versions of PHP, plus the new more enhanced Java like OOP features coming in PHP5. PHP can access the filesystem, several databases, can interact with different services and ports / sockets, can be used as a stand-alone application on the command line or as a GUI with GTK, as well as in conjunction with Apache for web scripting. Whatever fundamentals you learn with respect to procedural or OOP design can be applied to C/C++ or Java later on.